Lost Two Fantails Already To What Appears To Be...

ClinicaTerra · 12-23-2011, 07:13 PM

...the dreaded "Swim Bladder Disease" in which the goldfish do this "rapidly sucking" motion like they're gasping or choking beneath the surface of the water, and which eventually and gradually leads to their swimming upside down or on their side, and then eventually I find them deceased...

We just lost our beloved all-orange beautiful fantail ("Sunny") a couple of days ago, and lost a gorgeous Calico Fantail ("Keiko") a couple of months before that. Sunny and a Red Cap Oranda named "Sunshine" who is still alive and thriving in the tank were purchased as the starter fish for this aquarium about a year and a half ago, and Sunshine and another chocolate brown/gold colored fantail named "Oscar" are the only two left now, and appear to be growing and doing well. So Sunny and Sunshine have lived in this tank now for a year and a half, and Sunny just passed away a few days back...

My concern is that both Keiko and Sunny seemed to have died from the same "Swim Bladder Disease" in which they eventually began swimming upside down or on their sides, or even did sumersaults in the water...it was the strangest thing to witness. I was told to treat this with frozen cooked peas, which we fed them and seemed to improve the situation slightly, but they both eventually passed...

Could this be an ongoing problem with my goldies? I know they're prone to this bladder issue, but is it because I am feeding flakes that take a while to sink down and they're getting too much air into their gills? Should I try sinking pellets or some kind of other food? What else would cause the fish to swim upside down and list like this?

fishguy2727 · 12-23-2011, 08:13 PM

What size tank?
What filtration?
What water change schedule?
What is the nitrate concentration?
What do you feed?

ClinicaTerra · 12-23-2011, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fishguy2727

What size tank?

Per my signature, a 60 gallon rectangular.

Quote:

What filtration?

Per my signature, two HOBs -- an Aqueon QuietFlow 55 and an AquaClear 110.

Quote:

What water change schedule?

Not often enough, but they were all doing okay up until this point; I changed the water when it looked like the quality wasn't all that good, or if one of them started acting "off"...

Quote:

What is the nitrate concentration?

Don't know; didn't do a reading in awhile...

Quote:

What do you feed?

Was feeding Tetra Goldfish Flakes, now Aqueon Goldfish Flakes...

fishguy2727 · 12-23-2011, 10:29 PM

I only feed and recommend New Life Spectrum. IME it is by far the best food out right now.

You need to do water changes every single week. They should be at least 25%, more if needed to keep the nitrate under 20ppm before the water changes.

Waiting until things go bad and then trying to prevent them will not allow the fish to thrive long term.

If you provide high quality food and water they will thrive.

ClinicaTerra · 12-28-2011, 10:02 AM

So it's possibly the flakes I'm feeding that is causing this?

I tried the Tetra sinking pellets, but they don't seem to be taking to them.

fishguy2727 · 12-28-2011, 10:28 AM

That is fine, I wouldn't feed Tetra to anything. Try the NLS, you won't regret it.

ClinicaTerra · 12-29-2011, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fishguy2727

That is fine, I wouldn't feed Tetra to anything. Try the NLS, you won't regret it.

What is fine?

Why wouldn't you feed Tetra food? Just curious because I have been using their flakes since I was into tropicals many, many years ago...

I did a 30% (approx) water change last night so we'll see if the remaining two fish do a little better....

Could the fish FOOD I have been using killed these two goldfish?

fishguy2727 · 12-29-2011, 11:23 AM

It is fine that they aren't taking it, I suggest a higher quality food.

Tetra is not the best food out there. There are many things that affect how well a food is. IME New Life Spectrum is by far the best. The ingredients are of higher quality, there are no artificial colors or added preservatives, and the nutrition is more complete and balanced.

I don't think the food was actively killing them. The two main things for long term success are high quality food and water. Low quality food will cause problems long term, but shouldn't directly kill them short term.

ClinicaTerra · 12-29-2011, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fishguy2727

It is fine that they aren't taking it, I suggest a higher quality food.

Tetra is not the best food out there. There are many things that affect how well a food is. IME New Life Spectrum is by far the best. The ingredients are of higher quality, there are no artificial colors or added preservatives, and the nutrition is more complete and balanced.

I don't think the food was actively killing them. The two main things for long term success are high quality food and water. Low quality food will cause problems long term, but shouldn't directly kill them short term.

I see.

I actually looked at the NLS website and noticed under the goldfish food area that they mention their food cuts down on the possibility of fancy goldfish getting air in their bodies which leads to bloating issues...I think this is EXACTLY what my two fantails died of...

fishguy2727 · 12-29-2011, 08:06 PM

The food definitely helps, but water quality can cause it too. Both need to be high quality for fish to thrive long term.

ClinicaTerra · 01-03-2012, 11:31 AM

We actually replaced the two fantails we lost with two new ones this weekend -- I know that wasn't ideal when water conditions may not be perfect -- a Calico Ruynkin and a Red Ruynkin. I replaced my Aqueon filter's cartridges with two brand new ones, with fresh carbon, and I put in three new 100 ml packs of Purigen...one in the Aqueon and two in the AquaClear filter.

Hopefully this will clean up my water a bit.

You didn't tell me what you thought about my filtration -- do I have enough with the two HOBs?

12-23-2011, 07:13 PM	#1 (permalink)
ClinicaTerra Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 433 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Welcome to Aquarium Forum" 0 Times Said "Thanks" 6 Times Was Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Lost Two Fantails Already To What Appears To Be... ...the dreaded "Swim Bladder Disease" in which the goldfish do this "rapidly sucking" motion like they're gasping or choking beneath the surface of the water, and which eventually and gradually leads to their swimming upside down or on their side, and then eventually I find them deceased... We just lost our beloved all-orange beautiful fantail ("Sunny") a couple of days ago, and lost a gorgeous Calico Fantail ("Keiko") a couple of months before that. Sunny and a Red Cap Oranda named "Sunshine" who is still alive and thriving in the tank were purchased as the starter fish for this aquarium about a year and a half ago, and Sunshine and another chocolate brown/gold colored fantail named "Oscar" are the only two left now, and appear to be growing and doing well. So Sunny and Sunshine have lived in this tank now for a year and a half, and Sunny just passed away a few days back... My concern is that both Keiko and Sunny seemed to have died from the same "Swim Bladder Disease" in which they eventually began swimming upside down or on their sides, or even did sumersaults in the water...it was the strangest thing to witness. I was told to treat this with frozen cooked peas, which we fed them and seemed to improve the situation slightly, but they both eventually passed... Could this be an ongoing problem with my goldies? I know they're prone to this bladder issue, but is it because I am feeding flakes that take a while to sink down and they're getting too much air into their gills? Should I try sinking pellets or some kind of other food? What else would cause the fish to swim upside down and list like this? __________________ FUJIMOTO 60-GALLON RECTANGULAR - BLACK OAK STAND & FULL CANOPY - AQUEON GLASS VERSA-TOP (24"X1) & FLUORESCENT LIGHT STRIP - MARINELAND PERFECTO GLASS CANOPY (24"X1) AQUEON QUIETFLOW 55 325GPH (1) - HAGEN AQUACLEAR A-620/110 500GPH (1) RENA AIR 400 (1) - TETRA WHISPER 60 AIR PUMP (1) - PETCO BUBBLE BARS (18"X2) RED CAP ORANDA (1) - CHOCOLATE/GOLD FANTAIL (1) - CALICO RYUKIN (1) - NEW! - ]RED/ORANGE RYUKIN (1) - NEW!

12-23-2011, 08:13 PM	#2 (permalink)
fishguy2727 Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 114 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Welcome to Aquarium Forum" 1 Times Said "Thanks" 0 Times Was Thanked 31 Times in 31 Posts	Re: Lost Two Fantails Already To What Appears To Be... What size tank? What filtration? What water change schedule? What is the nitrate concentration? What do you feed? __________________ Biologist-Professional Aquarium Care-Published Author (Aquarium Fish International Magazine) Stocking has NOTHING to do with tank volume, it is all about water changes.

12-23-2011, 10:29 PM	#4 (permalink)
fishguy2727 Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 114 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Welcome to Aquarium Forum" 1 Times Said "Thanks" 0 Times Was Thanked 31 Times in 31 Posts	Re: Lost Two Fantails Already To What Appears To Be... I only feed and recommend New Life Spectrum. IME it is by far the best food out right now. You need to do water changes every single week. They should be at least 25%, more if needed to keep the nitrate under 20ppm before the water changes. Waiting until things go bad and then trying to prevent them will not allow the fish to thrive long term. If you provide high quality food and water they will thrive. __________________ Biologist-Professional Aquarium Care-Published Author (Aquarium Fish International Magazine) Stocking has NOTHING to do with tank volume, it is all about water changes.

12-28-2011, 10:02 AM	#5 (permalink)
ClinicaTerra Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 433 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Welcome to Aquarium Forum" 0 Times Said "Thanks" 6 Times Was Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Lost Two Fantails Already To What Appears To Be... So it's possibly the flakes I'm feeding that is causing this? I tried the Tetra sinking pellets, but they don't seem to be taking to them. __________________ FUJIMOTO 60-GALLON RECTANGULAR - BLACK OAK STAND & FULL CANOPY - AQUEON GLASS VERSA-TOP (24"X1) & FLUORESCENT LIGHT STRIP - MARINELAND PERFECTO GLASS CANOPY (24"X1) AQUEON QUIETFLOW 55 325GPH (1) - HAGEN AQUACLEAR A-620/110 500GPH (1) RENA AIR 400 (1) - TETRA WHISPER 60 AIR PUMP (1) - PETCO BUBBLE BARS (18"X2) RED CAP ORANDA (1) - CHOCOLATE/GOLD FANTAIL (1) - CALICO RYUKIN (1) - NEW! - ]RED/ORANGE RYUKIN (1) - NEW!

12-28-2011, 10:28 AM	#6 (permalink)
fishguy2727 Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 114 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Welcome to Aquarium Forum" 1 Times Said "Thanks" 0 Times Was Thanked 31 Times in 31 Posts	Re: Lost Two Fantails Already To What Appears To Be... That is fine, I wouldn't feed Tetra to anything. Try the NLS, you won't regret it. __________________ Biologist-Professional Aquarium Care-Published Author (Aquarium Fish International Magazine) Stocking has NOTHING to do with tank volume, it is all about water changes.

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12-29-2011, 11:23 AM	#8 (permalink)
fishguy2727 Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 114 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Welcome to Aquarium Forum" 1 Times Said "Thanks" 0 Times Was Thanked 31 Times in 31 Posts	Re: Lost Two Fantails Already To What Appears To Be... It is fine that they aren't taking it, I suggest a higher quality food. Tetra is not the best food out there. There are many things that affect how well a food is. IME New Life Spectrum is by far the best. The ingredients are of higher quality, there are no artificial colors or added preservatives, and the nutrition is more complete and balanced. I don't think the food was actively killing them. The two main things for long term success are high quality food and water. Low quality food will cause problems long term, but shouldn't directly kill them short term. __________________ Biologist-Professional Aquarium Care-Published Author (Aquarium Fish International Magazine) Stocking has NOTHING to do with tank volume, it is all about water changes.

12-29-2011, 08:06 PM	#10 (permalink)
fishguy2727 Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 114 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Welcome to Aquarium Forum" 1 Times Said "Thanks" 0 Times Was Thanked 31 Times in 31 Posts	Re: Lost Two Fantails Already To What Appears To Be... The food definitely helps, but water quality can cause it too. Both need to be high quality for fish to thrive long term. __________________ Biologist-Professional Aquarium Care-Published Author (Aquarium Fish International Magazine) Stocking has NOTHING to do with tank volume, it is all about water changes.

01-03-2012, 11:31 AM	#11 (permalink)
ClinicaTerra Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 433 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Welcome to Aquarium Forum" 0 Times Said "Thanks" 6 Times Was Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Lost Two Fantails Already To What Appears To Be... We actually replaced the two fantails we lost with two new ones this weekend -- I know that wasn't ideal when water conditions may not be perfect -- a Calico Ruynkin and a Red Ruynkin. I replaced my Aqueon filter's cartridges with two brand new ones, with fresh carbon, and I put in three new 100 ml packs of Purigen...one in the Aqueon and two in the AquaClear filter. Hopefully this will clean up my water a bit. You didn't tell me what you thought about my filtration -- do I have enough with the two HOBs? __________________ FUJIMOTO 60-GALLON RECTANGULAR - BLACK OAK STAND & FULL CANOPY - AQUEON GLASS VERSA-TOP (24"X1) & FLUORESCENT LIGHT STRIP - MARINELAND PERFECTO GLASS CANOPY (24"X1) AQUEON QUIETFLOW 55 325GPH (1) - HAGEN AQUACLEAR A-620/110 500GPH (1) RENA AIR 400 (1) - TETRA WHISPER 60 AIR PUMP (1) - PETCO BUBBLE BARS (18"X2) RED CAP ORANDA (1) - CHOCOLATE/GOLD FANTAIL (1) - CALICO RYUKIN (1) - NEW! - ]RED/ORANGE RYUKIN (1) - NEW!

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