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Old 09-17-2011, 09:23 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default What plants will Flourish Excel kill?

I've been using Flourish Excel as a carbon source for my 20 gallon tank. I haven't been able to find comprehensive information on what is compatible with it's use and what it does to the ecology of the tank: what effect it might have on the micro fauna and flora and invertebrates in addition to which plants are sensitive to it.
I had Elodea densa (anacharis) and it didn't tolerate it even using the dosing on the Seachem website. I replaced it with Wisteria. The other plants are a couple of Java ferns, an Anubias (nana, I think), two amazon swords (which have remained small), Echinodorus Bleheri (which I'm not sure was properly labeled), some dwarf sag and a little Java moss. The substrate is gravel with Flourish plant tabs and I use API leaf zone. Lighting is 24" T-5 dual bulb fixture with one 6500k and one 10000K bulb. Inhabitants are seven long fin zebra danios and 4 platys plus some snails that hitch hiked in with the plants. (I know some plant choices may outgrow the aquarium--I'll be happy to deal with that if I can get it to become an issue. And if I was starting over I'd use a different substrate but I got what I got and I'm learning from the current setup)
Does anyone know comprehensively what Flourish Excel does to a tank and what plants should be avoided when using it or know where I can find a good review about it's effects?
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Old 09-17-2011, 10:02 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: What plants will Flourish Excel kill?

Personally, I'd only use Excel if I needed it for a BBA breakout or something. It may be called a carbon replacement, but it will not and cannot replace CO2. There is no such thing. I am not even sure if plants benefit from it to be honest. Some will say they do.

You can search the internet and other forums like planted tank forums and come up with your own list and maybe even luck out with someone who has already made one. Everyone knows Crypts don't react well, but I've never had a problem when I used it unless I was overdosing.
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Old 09-17-2011, 03:09 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: What plants will Flourish Excel kill?

Hello Russell...

I can tell you the little I know. Flourish Excel contains an industrial form of carbon called "Gluteraldehyde". The SeaChem product contains just a trace, about 1.5 percent.

In high doses "Glut" is used to kill algae. Algae is a primitive plant, so other primitive plants like ferns, mosses and some varieties of Vallisneria can be damaged. I used Flourish Excel and another product called "Cidex" a couple of years ago, for a very short time and my Corkscrew Vals died within a couple of weeks and my Java fern was damaged, but recovered. My Singapore moss was uneffected. The little algae I had in my tanks was killed and hasn't returned, but I attribute that to heavily planted tanks. My other low light plants did pretty well.

I've found several liquids that work just as well, if not better than Flourish Excel and don't contain the "Glut" carbon fert.

B
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Old 09-17-2011, 05:01 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: What plants will Flourish Excel kill?

Hey, B.
What have you found that replaces the Flourish Excel?
Russell
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Old 09-17-2011, 05:37 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: What plants will Flourish Excel kill?

I have read about people using the Flourish to kill hair algae,is there any truth to this?
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Old 09-17-2011, 06:22 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: What plants will Flourish Excel kill?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Russell View Post
Hey, B.
What have you found that replaces the Flourish Excel?
Russell
Russell...

I started using organic liquids from the local hydroponics store. The brand name is "Earth Juice". The ferts are marketed for growing plants indoors without soil. I figured a plant was a plant and the ingredients were all natural, so I mixed a little with my water change water and my low light plants really like the stuff. Attached are some pics of a couple of my planted tanks I took a few weeks ago. I have less than one watt of light per gallon of tank volume, but experiment with some different substrates and ferts and can even grow some moderate light plants.

B
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Old 09-17-2011, 08:43 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: What plants will Flourish Excel kill?

Quote:
Originally Posted by giddetm View Post
I have read about people using the Flourish to kill hair algae,is there any truth to this?
Seachem does not promote Flourish Excel as an algaecide but they do note they've had reports of it's efficacy in ridding tanks of hair algae. It killed the hair algae in my tank in less than two weeks. I used the full initial dose as directed on the bottle then followed with the every other day dosing suggested on the seachem web site for tanks with anacharis. As I wrote, it also killed the anacharis. Please note that this applies to Flourish EXCEL, which essentially contains gluteraldehyde, not plain Flourish. Gluteraldehyde is a powerful antimicrobrial/antiviral agent used to disinfect surgical instruments so it may have untoward effects. I'm now using full dosing since I switched to wisteria. I am concerned that it may not be good for the Java fern and moss but I'm not sure there is a negative effect yet. I have to admit the demise of the hair algae was satisfying even though I lost the anacharis.
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Old 09-17-2011, 09:11 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: What plants will Flourish Excel kill?

Whether you use Excel or an alternate with Glut, they can still both have the same negative effects on your plants. In fact, since the other sources are stronger and you don't watch your dosage you can do worse damage. Just takes some attention.

No matter which source you use, there is not an effective replacement for carbon....not if you think it will give the same effects as CO2. If it were effective at doing that, nearly everyone would be doing it - and it just isn't happening. And Excel is not a type of fert.
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Old 09-20-2011, 07:35 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: What plants will Flourish Excel kill?

Some of the plants to be affected by Excel include Anacharis, Sags, Vals and any liverworts like Riccia.

I tend to avoid it personnally. I'd much rather use CO2 and dry ferts. Much better and cheaper in the long run.
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Old 09-20-2011, 07:57 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: What plants will Flourish Excel kill?

wow this is good to know, i was wondering why my ancharis and vals all died for no reason. I dose a ton of excel in my 90 gallon tank, well not a ton but the reccomended dosage, my swords, tiger lotus and anubias all seem to be doing great though.
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Old 09-20-2011, 08:18 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: What plants will Flourish Excel kill?

I have read stories of it killing all plants in a tank regardless of type and even killing shrimp and fish. I used Cidex for a little while. I have burned big brown spots onto my Amazon Swords and melted leaves on Wisteria. Nearly lost all my Crypts then. Anacharis seems to really be sensitive to it, IME. I dosed to very low levels (battling BBA) and still my Anacharis would end up dead.
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